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Author Topic: DOMES, UNDERGROUND SHELTERS, etc. New Topic for  (Read 8629 times)

Yowbarb

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Yowbarb

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Re: DOMES, UNDERGROUND SHELTERS, etc. New Topic for
« Reply #1 on: December 11, 2014, 02:27:00 PM »
I inadvertently deleted the whole Topic on Underground Shelter, Domes, etc. at 4 in the morning.
Was just trying to delete a post of mine and re-do it.  Instead hit the "Delete Topic" button.
It is quite a loss...links and ideas and discusssions going back years.
Update: It is not possible to put this Topic back. It would be too much of an expense at this time.
I will be re-posting some sites, links, images and ideas...
- Barb Townsend
« Last Edit: December 11, 2014, 08:39:27 PM by Yowbarb »

Yowbarb

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Re: DOMES, UNDERGROUND SHELTERS, etc. New Topic for
« Reply #2 on: December 11, 2014, 08:32:29 PM »
http://www.monolithic.org/monolithic/photos#5

Monolithic Dome Rentals — The Inn Place is a thriving example of Monolithic Dome Rentals. There are over fifty Io-20 rental units in this complex with more to come. (Megann Lewis)

The Inn Place  http://www.monolithic.org/rentals/the-inn-place-new-rentals-old-pattern

http://www.domeliving.com/  Dome Living

Yowbarb

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Re: DOMES, UNDERGROUND SHELTERS, etc. New Topic for
« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2014, 10:52:14 AM »
Advanced Community Planning Series #4: Quick Setup 2012 Survival Domes - Michael Maxon and Linda Schiller-Hanna
http://yowusa.com/radio/cttc/2011/cttc-0511-135/1.shtml

Yowbarb

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Re: DOMES, UNDERGROUND SHELTERS, etc. New Topic for
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2016, 04:26:42 PM »
Yowbarb Note: More info about domes available with the latest book from Marshall and Jennifer Masters,
Surviving the Planet X Tribulation: A Faith-Based Leadership Guide.
link:
https://kmmedia.org/product_info.php?cPath=81&products_id=211
432 Pages, 142 Ill., 13pt Body Type
Includes 2 Copyable Audio Cds

This 432 page leadership guide with 142 color illustrations features a first-of-its-kind approach to surviving the coming Planet X tribulation, the days of darkness, the pole shift, and beyond. Written in a gentle and empowering style for faith-based leaders and those in awareness, it presents a non-violent strategy for enlightened continuity and comfort in survival villages of 100 or more people.

The purpose of this book is to help those who are ready to take action during the last possible window of opportunity to prepare effectively for what is coming. This is a time when newly aware faith-based leaders who trust their own inner guidance will know that they must take action quickly if they are to lead their flocks to safety, and why untested Cold War strategies for sheltering and preparedness are unsuited to the demands of an extended tribulation. The strategy in this book is.

Includes Two Copyable Audio CDs

This edition come with our Surviving the Planet X Tribulation Supplemental Audio CD set.  These interviews by Marshall Masters directly address a cornerstone concept presented in our book, Surviving the Planet X Tribulation: A Faith-based Leadership Guide.  The use of concrete domes as strong, safe, rapid deployment structures.  Domes are an ancient, time-tested design and offer durable survivability for both single family and multifamily shelters.

Disc No. 1: Low-Tech Arcosanti Domes

Arcologist Erin Jeffries of Arcosanti, Arizona introduces the city's novel, low-tech approach to constructing dwellings and communities. 

Disc No. 2: High-Tech Monolithic Domes

In this strategic planning interview with Monolithic Dome co-inventor and CEO, David B. South you'll learn a faster high-tech approach to building concrete domes.

https://kmmedia.org/product_info.php?cPath=81&products_id=211

Yowbarb

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Re: DOMES, UNDERGROUND SHELTERS, etc. New Topic for
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2016, 05:33:46 PM »
Yowbarb Note: No matter what dome plan you buy, or who you hire, or if you do it yourself , if you are really building for survival, here are some ideas.
Not a lot of windows, unless you have a pre-made piece of fiberglass or metal you can fasten on the outside - and the one on the inside.

Doors need to be able to be barred from inside.
Consider situations of sudden wind, torrential rain, fire etc. where you need to get people into the shelter. Perhaps you can put a cat, dog door so last minute arrivals can run in, if you need to, with the flaps set so they can get in and not out , in an emergency.
If there is a cat-dog flap, again it is an open space for the elements to get into - and you need to be able to bolt, or slide a cover over it, securely from the inside.

I am not an electrical expert. Some people have posted "do not use metal." Some have said to use glass fiber reinforced concrete for the domes, instead of rebar.
 
When it comes to large coverings for a dome top, front area with windows and doors:
Well there are not a lot of materials other than metal that would hold up to high winds, fireballs, etc. I mean to cover things, but if you know of something, for sure, please post it here.

Something been bothering me for years, even in the better dome sites they always seem to have lots of glass on the outside, etc. There is never a mention of a cover for it, or for something you can affix to the outside when high winds start, etc. So it will be up to you to protect your self and your group. If you have to pay extra for a surface to fasten on, for covers for windows and doors on the inside, then please do that!!

It doesn't do any good to have an indestructible dome structure if the windows and doors just blow in. Remember, a high wind, wave, blast of fire that will affect any resident of said dome, if it gets inside!! Such a wind or wave could break every opening and suck the people right out of it. There will be no second chances so try to get it built right the first time. If it cannot be built perfectly do the best you can and then get the necessary coverings for the doors and windows.

There was a dome church in the deep south that sheltered the entire congregation. Not even the windows broke. Well they were not glass windows, they were thick plexiglass, firmly set into a recessed area. The windows were recessed about a foot. I have posted about that church over the years, worth repeating.

1) The first image below: These domes have a lot of glass to try and quickly cover in an emergency.

2) The second image below doesn't have so many door and window openings. It might not be too difficult to order or to have special covers built, to quickly cover the openings - even the bubbles on top.

Socrates

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A straw bale dome
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2016, 10:56:57 PM »
Building a shelter/house is one of the MAJOR aspects of survival. I don't see people taking it seriously, because you have to assume you might either be on the run [from people or nature] or have to be mobile for any number of reasons and you can't take your house with you. So you need to have an idea of how to set up camp quickly.
Now you also have to take into account that it could be quite cold, or for that matter, also dangerous, quite hot. A tent will then not suffice. Digging a hole, if possible at all, takes time. What will you do? Let's reiterate: you need to have a method of housing that'll keep you...
- mobile
- fast
- warm/cool

These are not exaggerated things to consider. If you're talking survival at all, you will need to think about a housing method that takes the above into account. If you survive because you have knowledge, location, and perhaps supplies enough to eat,, but your house is destroyed or far away, you will probably still die without proper shelter! So you made an amazing shelter, but the location turns out to be wrong, or you're driven from it, or were away from it and couldn't get to it; you have no place to stay, no shelter; now what? All you have left is knowhow.

That is why i fell in love with the idea of strawbale housing years ago. Nothing i've ever heard of compares. Like any system, you need building materials, straw or hay or dead organic matter to tie into bundles, but you DON'T need tools like saws or hammers or even nails. You don't need logs or bricks or the tools to deal with them. You also don't need the warmth of the sun to dry your concrete or adobe or mud.
You can build a strawbale with your bare hands, but with your strawbale you'll have a building block with which to be able to construct housing that is warm, cool,, quick, cheap, and simple to build, durable, and ultimately fire-resistant if covered with lime. NOTHING, no other building scheme offers all of that, yet demands so little.
You can build a strawbale home when you're on the run, when you're settling in for the winter, or if you plan to build for decades.

You may think: "Yeah, but what about..." Forget it! There are no drawbacks. If covered with lime, it is more fire-resistant than any other building you can think of, short of a meter of concrete [but then you're not talking about survival]. When you cover it with lime or mud, which are natural methods one can use almost everywhere, any drawbacks the straw may have had disappear. But in a survival setting where you don't have time to lime or cob, you'll suffer the smell, rodents, itch, and fire hazard, yes. But then what other housing would have saved you from such? But at least you'll survive the elements and that's more than an option like a tent offers when harsh weather comes by.


Years ago i was charmed by monolithic domes, but then ran into strawbale building. I considered that the two needed to be combined, but there were no photos and only one story of such a building to be found on the internet at the time. But i KNEW i was right. Building straw into a dome is the only way to go. Regular strawbale builders won't help you because they demand you make a wooden roof, which is stupid because you build the walls in an hour, at no cost, and then your roof comes to many times the effort and resources the rest of the house ever did.

At a strawbale workshop i was at,, no shade, 30 degrees,, i got the group together and had a strawbale igloo built in 20 MINUTES! Everyone loved it! Instant shade and comfort.
video
I had to think of how to build a strawbale dome in my head all by myself. And the only plans on the internet involve geodesic domes as a framework, but that means more tools, more materials, more knowhow, and more time. Which is great if you have them. But they are NOT NECESSARY.

The dome is unique in that it can be built WITHOUT A FRAME. You start with a circle and work you way up by ever-smaller circles until it closes. You don't need a frame of any kind and i'm going to explain what i've come up with to not only allow the safest kind of structure one can imagine, but one that will allow it to be quite large, as well, which can be very desirable when dealing with larger groups and their needs for air [high ceiling].

You can build a small strawbale dome easily, just by going round and round in circles until you reach the top.

read more here
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Yowbarb

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Re: A straw bale dome
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2016, 02:22:23 PM »
.....
You may think: "Yeah, but what about..." Forget it! There are no drawbacks. If covered with lime, it is more fire-resistant than any other building you can think of, short of a meter of concrete [but then you're not talking about survival]. When you cover it with lime or mud, which are natural methods one can use almost everywhere, any drawbacks the straw may have had disappear.

read more here

Sounds OK we have had posts about strawbale, etc. dozens of topics about various types...

To me, there are different types of housing for different scenarios. If a person has the bucks it would be good to build a dome which could, for sure withstand extremely high winds etc. Then there are situations where the worst of it has not hit but the group needs to put something up in ahurry...and then there are the Aftertime buildings..

Socrates

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Re: DOMES, UNDERGROUND SHELTERS, etc. New Topic for
« Reply #8 on: September 11, 2016, 12:21:42 AM »
Take Fordhall; all of their neighbors and then, ALL OF FRIGGIN' ENGLAND should have been copying their accomplishments.

There's a test they give to children: if you don't eat this piece of candy now, you'll get another piece later on. And most kids eat their piece of candy anyway but the kids that are able to postpone gratification in that situation turn out to be the most successful people later in life. Well, soil's like that too, for if you cut down a forest and use up the soil, that's like eating your one piece of candy right away, but if you can go to the trouble of dealing with the forest intelligently, that's like being able to postpone gratification and deal with growing food intelligently. In other words: stupid people just mine soil; smart people figure out how to create it.

Both dome and straw bale building are just more of these crazy kind of things that are so logical, efficient and easy that's you have to wonder why [whyyy? Why?! or In God's name, WHY?!!!] people all over the world have not been applying them for millennia.

First, in the case of straw bales, all we're talking about is digging a ditch, laying down some rope, filling the ditch with dead, dry organic matter and stepping on it or something to press it down before you bind it all together.
Any dry organic matter; could be pine needles, could be grass, leaves... Whatever.
Bricks created in this way insulate against both heat and cold like crazy.
Tipis? Log cabins? Houses of big rocks clued together with lime? Why?
I get that if you have a load of rocks lying around you're gonna come up with the idea to build with it, but to heat that pile of rocks for the rest of your life like crazy because you couldn't line the inside with dry organic material tied together with rope? That i don't get.

With domes it's quite similar; of course building straight up is easy and the first thing to pop into your head [i.e. like one of those kids just popping his piece of candy into his mouth] but that's really all you and your generation or culture can come up with? C'mon.

The logical next step is just to put those two basic ideas together, put a straw roof or something on there and never have to worry about fire, wind, cold or heat inside again.
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Yowbarb

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Re: DOMES, UNDERGROUND SHELTERS, etc. New Topic for
« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2016, 03:51:03 AM »
Socrates PLS check your messages. I just sent two msgs about the straw bale homes...

Yowbarb

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Re: DOMES, UNDERGROUND SHELTERS, etc. New Topic for
« Reply #10 on: September 11, 2016, 04:01:40 AM »
I will be reading through your forum and topics on this, http://b2012overleven.runboard.com/t5
No doubt, lots of information there...

Socrates

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Straw bale dome II
« Reply #11 on: September 11, 2016, 09:10:49 AM »
Perhaps most won't have read into the matter of straw bale and dome building so much and have great question marks concerning safety and strength issues, so i continue...

Domes are STRONG. They are safe, either as shelter or as home. Imagine having a strawbale dome roof and having something come down from the sky; a dome will absorb like nothing else can and quite possibly reflect whatever comes your way, perhaps thrown there by the force of a megastorm or tornado. Concrete geodesic domes have withstood blows that would've demolished any similar regular construct. A telephone pole that fell during a storm and crashed into a dome house, something that would destroy any normal wall, caused no damage. The dome shape is unique in its ability to not only withstand the elements but also to not attract in the first place, like certain shapes invite the wind to collect and carry it away.

Strawbale and dome buildings are also safe from FIRE. When a fire once ravaged an area, nothing was left standing except for a strawbale wall. Once covered in a layer of lime or cob, heat only chars a few centimeter of the hay, the outer layer, but after the oxygen is gone within the strawbale wall, the rest of the hay remains untouched and insulates while remaining as support, i.e. you're strawbale wall just becomes a few percent thinner, that's all. A test with a 1000 degree fire on one side of a strawbale wall, had the temperature on the other side go up by a mere 6 degrees.
The dome structure, too, is amazing. A fire that passed over a dome house, left it almost completely untouched, as the fire, like wind, can't get a good hold on the rounded form.

A strawbale dome also means that IF it were to fall down, you'd be having strawbales falling down on you... Not concrete, not beams of wood, etc. Just strawbales. And you can cut your way out from under them, too, even if you have to use your teeth. Try that with a slab of concrete on top of you!
A strawbale dome structure is also flexible enough to keep standing in case of a major earthquake. It is not rigid. Though you can drive a car over a strawbale dome, it is nothing like one big solid brick or concrete wall. Its strength is more complex, but no less sturdy for all of that.


Straw bales are an important SURVIVAL tool/technique/tactic; you can go out into a jungle, forest or plain and manage to build straw bales with your bare hands. Clay can be found almost anywhere there's a stream or river which means you have access to the main ingredient for cob (you use to cover the straw with).
Cob may not be the ideal cover for your roof [though it's not bad], so you might consider using something like straw or reed for that.

People used to make rope out of grass in the Andes and they'd build bridges out of said rope, too. So in order to be able to make straw bale bricks, you either require access to natural cord or you make it yourself from something like grass.

Now, making CONCRETE, that's a different story. Is it stronger than straw bales? Of course. But you're no longer talking either survival or basics. Hell, after the Romans stopped making their version of concrete, all of Europe went without for 1500 years, that's how big a deal it is to make.
Anyway, besides, there are many KINDS of strength. For one, the oldest straw bale structure is over a century old, so there's that kind of strength, too. And though a bullet might come through a straw bale wall, air and moisture also get through so you don't wind up dying from lack of fresh air or fungi problems...
I'm just saying; compared to the few potential drawbacks of building with straw, there are so many great benefits that it is surely worth your while to consider as an option, either for now or in case of trouble.
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ilinda

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Re: DOMES, UNDERGROUND SHELTERS, etc. New Topic for
« Reply #12 on: September 11, 2016, 05:11:28 PM »
ASAP I'll get pics of a school near us (Belgrade, MO) that replaced their "normal" building about 20 years ago with several domes.  It did appear so strange in a time when dome construction was considered weird hippie-stuff.

 IIRC, there are few if any windows in these school domes and they seem taller than one would imagine is needed, but maybe there is a loft of some kind--library?  teacher's lounge?

Pics to follow.

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Re: DOMES, UNDERGROUND SHELTERS, etc. New Topic for
« Reply #13 on: September 11, 2016, 06:00:05 PM »
Socrates, re strawbale domes, can you post any data you may have on how to quickly cover the straw tops with something so it could resist fire.
My two main concerns are fire and also possibly not having the structure anchored enough, high wind etc.

In a planet X or other scenario, there could be fire from a few different sources:

regular, seasonal forest fires
lightning strikes
wind-caused damage to industrial facilities with resultant leaking of flammable oils and liquids...
electrical explosions from buildings breaking up
fireballs
volcanic fissures nearby igniting woods and grasslands

Let us know what could be done in the fire scenario...

Yowbarb

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Re: DOMES, UNDERGROUND SHELTERS, etc. New Topic for
« Reply #14 on: September 11, 2016, 06:26:02 PM »
ASAP I'll get pics of a school near us (Belgrade, MO) that replaced their "normal" building about 20 years ago with several domes.  It did appear so strange in a time when dome construction was considered weird hippie-stuff.

 IIRC, there are few if any windows in these school domes and they seem taller than one would imagine is needed, but maybe there is a loft of some kind--library?  teacher's lounge?

Pics to follow.

ilinda, I am so glad to hear about nearby domes for schoolchildren and possibly there would be enough room for teachers, family members !
Posting an image of a domes which resisted a tornado.
...
http://www.monolithic.org/benefits/benefits-survivability

http://www.monolithic.org/benefits/benefits-survivability/tornado-hits-monolithic-dome-in-durant-mississippi

Tornado Hits Monolithic Dome in Durant, Mississippi

On April 27, 2011, an F3 tornado, with winds between 158-206 mph, hit the small town of Durant, Mississippi, including the Monolithic Dome home and garage of Mr. and Mrs. Lee Avery.

2:15 a.m. on April 27, 2011
An F3 tornado, with winds between 158-206 mph, hit the small town of Durant, Mississippi, including the Monolithic Dome home and garage of Mr. and Mrs. Lee Avery.

Built in 2009 by South Industries, Inc., the Averys have a 40-foot diameter dome-home joined by a tube connector to a 30-foot diameter dome-garage. The tornado did not hurt either Monolithic Dome, but did damage other property.

Lee sent an email report:
I’m currently using a temporary computer to log onto the Internet. Hopefully, our service will be reactivated soon.

At 2:15 A.M. on Wednesday, an F3 funnel cloud passed over my house. I was watching the toilet bowl water being sucked out as the funnel passed overhead. When it went by, the water came gushing out like a fountain.

I knew the winds had to be over 100 mph because I’ve driven over 100 mph in the rain before and know the sound. I knew it was a funnel cloud because all 4 windows in my house were being hit by straight wind simultaneously.

The house survived untouched (except the leaf spatters all over the surface). The same could not be said about my 100+ year-old trees. Every one of them was sheared off or knocked over at the roots. One very large tree fell across my driveway trapping me at home for 2 days. Power and water were out for 61 hours (ice cold sponge baths 3 days straight).

Being in my house, I felt no fear about the storm raging outside. Cleanup of the trees was a mess. When I’ve got the internet restored, I’ll send pictures of the fallen trees at my house and my next door neighbor’s house.

Regards,
Lee

 

Surviving the Planet X Tribulation: A Faith-Based Leadership Guide

Surviving the Planet X Tribulation: A Faith-Based Leadership Guide

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