Author Topic: Trenches: design, location, etc.  (Read 3651 times)

Jimfarmer

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Trenches: design, location, etc.
« on: April 22, 2014, 08:40:42 AM »
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Re: Planet X Predictive Dreams
« Reply #386 on: April 21, 2014, 12:27:34 PM »
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Quote from: Jimfarmer on April 18, 2014, 07:36:46 PM

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The wind will be so strong nothing will stand.  NOTHING WILL STAND, do you understand?

    So, when the pole shift starts, the safest refuge is in a trench (not a cave, because of the earthquakes).  Let's start a new topic:  "Trench design and considerations",  or something similar.  I have a few ideas to contribute.

Trench - with reinforcements...?

Most important:
1.  Drainage for torrential rain and urine.
2.  Complete or partial cover that won't be ripped off by intense winds.
3.  Raised floor, grid or perforated for drainage.

What else?

ilinda

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Re: Trenches: design, location, etc.
« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2014, 06:08:25 PM »
It will be important to figure the projected wind direction so as to determine the best orientation of the site.  IOW, if we assume, and this is really just an assumption, that the fiercest winds will be from the west, then facing west would not be good.  Seems to me facing east or even north might be better.  But then, think of those "north winds".  Gee, this might get complicated!
Maybe others have some good ideas.

Jimfarmer

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Re: Trenches: design, location, etc.
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2014, 08:26:20 AM »
It will be important to figure the projected wind direction so as to determine the best orientation of the site.  IOW, if we assume, and this is really just an assumption, that the fiercest winds will be from the west, then facing west would not be good.  Seems to me facing east or even north might be better.  But then, think of those "north winds".  Gee, this might get complicated!
Maybe others have some good ideas.

During the pole shift, the winds will come from any and all directions.

ilinda

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Re: Trenches: design, location, etc.
« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2014, 06:16:30 AM »
It will be important to figure the projected wind direction so as to determine the best orientation of the site.  IOW, if we assume, and this is really just an assumption, that the fiercest winds will be from the west, then facing west would not be good.  Seems to me facing east or even north might be better.  But then, think of those "north winds".  Gee, this might get complicated!
Maybe others have some good ideas.

During the pole shift, the winds will come from any and all directions.

Makes perfect sense actually.  One thing hubby did when recently building a new woodshed.  He used those "hurricane ties" to help hold the joists, rafters, girders, etc., together, and they really do strengthen a building more than conventional construction ties.  I think he also used a special type of screw rathen than nails which can more easily pull out, compared to screws.  Much to think about here.

Jimfarmer

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Re: Trenches: design, location, etc.
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2014, 08:57:38 AM »
Location ideas:

*  Near the residence, for quick access.

* Away from trees, cliffs, buildings, vehicles, etc.

*  On high ground - no downslope runoff into the trench.

Yowbarb

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Re: Trenches: design, location, etc.
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2014, 09:40:44 AM »
Jim what a great new Topic!
Thank you,
Yowbarb

Jimfarmer

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Re: Trenches: design, location, etc.
« Reply #6 on: April 27, 2014, 03:29:43 PM »
In-trench supplies:

*  Waterproof sheets.

*  Flashlights.

*  Machete.

*  Wasp spray (for uninvited creatures).

*  Knife.

*  Tongs with long handles;  barbeque set.

*  Crowbar.

*  Multi-tool.

*  First-Aid kit.

*  Water for drinking and washing.

*  Breakfast or energy bars.

*  Inflatable mattresses (two per person, one over and one under.

*  Rainwear -  complete set.

*  Candles and lighters.

*  Toilet paper.

*  Baby wipes

*  Daily medications.

What else?
« Last Edit: April 27, 2014, 08:38:45 PM by Jimfarmer »

steedy

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Re: Trenches: design, location, etc.
« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2014, 05:43:20 PM »
Seems to me it would be easier to have all that stuff stored in a basement or cellar house instead of trying to drag it all outside to a trench in high winds.

Jimfarmer

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Re: Trenches: design, location, etc.
« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2014, 08:35:15 PM »
Seems to me it would be easier to have all that stuff stored in a basement or cellar house instead of trying to drag it all outside to a trench in high winds.

Indeed, some logistic planning in advance is indicated in this situation.

Basements and  cellars will not be safe.  All the structure above them could fall down into them.

So, we gather the supplies and store them somewhere while we construct the trench.  Then, at some point, we transfer the supplies to the trench. Maybe in two or three batches as the situation worsens.  Finally, we want to be able to run out of the residence in our underwear and dive into the trench at a moment's notice.

ilinda

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Re: Trenches: design, location, etc.
« Reply #9 on: April 28, 2014, 05:50:57 AM »
In-trench supplies:

*  Waterproof sheets.

*  Flashlights.

*  Machete.

*  Wasp spray (for uninvited creatures).

*  Knife.

*  Tongs with long handles;  barbeque set.

*  Crowbar.

*  Multi-tool.

*  First-Aid kit.

*  Water for drinking and washing.

*  Breakfast or energy bars.

*  Inflatable mattresses (two per person, one over and one under.

*  Rainwear -  complete set.

*  Candles and lighters.

*  Toilet paper.

*  Baby wipes

*  Daily medications.

What else?
Possibly essential oils of several types--the ones that are not toxic to humans, but which repel bugs.  A drop or two on a bit of sponge will emanate aromas that repel many types of bugs.  They take up less space than bug spray, and if I understand this correctly, you are planning for very small spaces here.

Jimfarmer

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Re: Trenches: design, location, etc.
« Reply #10 on: April 28, 2014, 08:31:51 AM »
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Possibly essential oils of several types--the ones that are not toxic to humans, but which repel bugs.  A drop or two on a bit of sponge will emanate aromas that repel many types of bugs

Ah, yes, of course.  And anti-itch cream.
Adding to the Supplies list:
*  Gloves.
*  Goggles.
*  Hard hat.
*  Baby wipes.
*  Bug repellent (essential oils on a sponge)
*  Anti-itch and antibiotic creams.
*  Medications for pain, diarrhea, and upset stomach.

Also adding to the design:
*  Sealed or covered sides.
*  Double walls so that incoming runoff goes down between them.

I will make a new consolidated document (single-spaced this time).
« Last Edit: April 28, 2014, 09:16:19 AM by Jimfarmer »

Jimfarmer

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Re: Trenches: design, location, etc.
« Reply #11 on: May 04, 2014, 05:36:37 PM »
Here is my consolidated updated list.

-------------------------------------------
SAFETY TRENCH

Need:

During the pole shift, there will be earthquakes of magnitude 9+ and winds of 200+ mph everywhere.  Nothing will remain standing.  The only safe place will be in a narrow trench.  Basements and  cellars will not be safe because all the structure above them could fall down into them.


Location:

*  Near the residence, for quick access.
*  Away from trees, cliffs, buildings, vehicles, etc.
*  On high ground - no downslope runoff into the trench.


Design:

*  Drainage for torrential rain and urine.
*  Complete or partial reinforced cover that won't be ripped off by intense winds.
*  Raised floor, grid or perforated for drainage.
*  Sealed or covered sides.
*  Double walls so that incoming runoff goes down between them.


In-trench supplies:

*  Waterproof sheets.
*  Flashlights.
*  Machete.
*  Wasp spray (for uninvited creatures).
*  Knife.
*  Tongs with long handles;  barbeque set.
*  Crowbar.
*  Multi-tool.
*  Scoops and scrapers.
*  Gloves.
*  Goggles.
*  Hard hat.
*  First-Aid kit.
*  Water for drinking and washing.
*  Breakfast or energy bars.
*  Inflatable mattresses (two per person, one over and one under).
*  Sleeping bags.
*  Rainwear -  complete set, including boots.
*  Warm clothing - one complete set per person.
*  Bath towels.
*  Candles and lighters.
*  Toilet paper.
*  Baby wipes.
*  Sponges.
*  Empty plastic bags.
*  Bug repellent (essential oils on a sponge).
*  Anti-itch and antibiotic creams.
*  Medications for pain, diarrhea, and upset stomach.
*  Daily medications.


Preparations:

Some logistic planning in advance is indicated in this situation.

So, we gather the supplies and store them somewhere while we construct the trench.  Then, at some point, we transfer the supplies to the trench. Maybe in two or three batches as the situation worsens.  Finally, we want to be able to run out of the residence in our underwear and dive into the trench at a moment's notice.
------------------------------------------

Yowbarb

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Re: Trenches: design, location, etc.
« Reply #12 on: May 04, 2014, 07:42:25 PM »
JimFarmer, great ideas...

R.R. Book

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Re: Trenches: design, location, etc.
« Reply #13 on: April 23, 2017, 07:06:46 AM »
As an interesting default test of 200 mph wind results:

This past February, 2017 winds reached just under 200 mph in Squaw Valley in the Sierra Nevada mountain range. The highest winds of 199 mph were recorded at Ward Peak within the Alpine Meadows ski resort.  The resort appears to have been well constructed and able to withstand the winds, perhaps partly due to having been built in the shelter of the mountains rather than in an exposed position.

This means that the resort stood firmly with hurricane winds exceeding the Saffir-Simpson scale.  The below article does say that even the most well-constructed or reinforced building cannot be expected to withstand F5 tornado winds (261-318 mph), and that a reinforced safe space should be added for protection.

It is possible to invest in some tornado and hurricane reinforcements for an existing structure:
http://www.popularmechanics.com/home/interior-projects/how-to/g605/8-ways-to-protect-your-home-against-tornadoes-and-hurricanes/ 

Thoughts?
« Last Edit: April 23, 2017, 01:43:33 PM by R.R. Book »

Socrates

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megagales and megaquakes
« Reply #14 on: April 23, 2017, 08:45:10 AM »
8 Ways to Protect Your Home Against Tornadoes and Hurricanes
Cable-Tite looks useful.


Earth's atmosphere is zooming around at about 1000kph; it usually doesn't destroy much because the Earth, too, is moving that fast and in the same direction...
Did someone mention 300kph winds?
Okay, i read somewhere that there might be maximum speeds that winds can go, but, still, if we're talking, say, 500kph winds rather than 300, that's a big difference right there. And, obviously, we're talking winds that are [as the above article rightly put it] carrying 2x4's flying around like missiles. But with megagales in mind, let's make that: grown trees flying around like missiles...

I think there's a reason ancient accounts speak of the handful of survivors [i.e. in the world!] lasting in caves. But this is a thread on trenches and i, too, have not discounted the option completely.
But as i see it, whatever you come up with, one must assume you're dealing with unimaginable winds that might scour the landscape, not just ripping away all trees and constructions, but also the ground itself; after all, dirt can fly away. Deep roots and the like may help to work to keep it in place, something akin to rebar in concrete, but it's really too late to be planting deep-rooting trees.
So i think one should be looking at trenches within bedrock. That either means finding such places or digging down deep [the latter option being quite precarious because of to be expected megaquakes].


Concrete
I once corresponded with a concrete expert and he pointed out some interesting things. For one, he addressed the 'myth' of 'super-strong concrete'; he said that's just about saving money and space and that extra layers of 'regular' concrete are as good as the best high-tech stuff [assuming you get it right].

Another thing he pointed out (that i as layman had no idea about) is that most of the strength of the concrete is achieved soon after pouring; and that, though the curing process does make the concrete stronger still, you'll have over half of the cured strength in just a few days.

A friend recently pointed out to me that concrete has great vertical strength and quite poor 'horizontal' strength. This is why steel structures form the backbone of constructs.
That means that during megaquakes, concrete is prone to cracking and breaking up if it can move (at all). That, obviously, includes 'moving' up and down, i.e. megaquakes bouncing things around that aren't duly connected to immobile rocks [like bedrock; enter Cable-Tite and such].

Megaquakes
I think the same might be said about megaquakes as one might say about megagales: that they are likely unimaginably stronger than anything we've ever heard about.
If the Alps are just 12,000 years old and popped up quite quickly back then [which is, geologically speaking, like... yesterday], only then might one have an idea of the degree and scope of destruction that might be expected to occur again. But, no, we've all had drilled into us at school that mountains and the Grand Canyon change extremely slowly. Well, i mean, that is, that's what everyone believed [in...] until the new theory came around that the Grand Canyon was created during a single devastating event, or a few such events [possibly having to do with Lake Missoula].
So, think bigger. That is, if you wanna live...

A trench in dirt would likely not hold form during a megaquake; and the power of masses of moving dirt is not something you can build against. So, again, go with bedrock.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2017, 09:01:05 AM by Socrates »
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