Planet X Town Hall

Yowbarb - SURVIVING the CHANGES => Surviving on the Move => Topic started by: Lori on April 15, 2010, 06:38:59 AM

Title: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Lori on April 15, 2010, 06:38:59 AM
This is an interesting article.  Its very informative.


http://adventure.howstuffworks.com/survival/wilderness/how-to-find-water.htm (http://adventure.howstuffworks.com/survival/wilderness/how-to-find-water.htm)

Lori,  Great site and good basic information.   

I remember somewhere that Oxfam or Care were  giving out a water purifier that you simply put in the water and sucked on to drink.  They were passing them out in Africa.   They might be good to have on hand in our survival kits.
As a backpacker I have a water filter pump and several replacement filters.
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: 1969quartz0 on April 15, 2010, 10:31:00 AM
Lori I liked the Phil West video when he talks about testing food, I have heard most of this before but you can never hear info. like this to much when you are in a high stress situation if it is not ingrained in your brain you are in trouble. Thanks
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Lori on April 15, 2010, 11:22:13 AM
I havn't been able to get any of theses kits yet.  I would love too, though as soon as we can.


 
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Yowbarb on April 15, 2010, 02:13:00 PM
Lori I liked the Phil West video when he talks about testing food, I have heard most of this before but you can never hear info. like this to much when you are in a high stress situation if it is not ingrained in your brain you are in trouble. Thanks

1969quartz0  this is a really good point. If a person is not prepared to test food he might stuff it into his mouth.
If does not have a way to test or to immediately purify water, he might be glugging something down he shouldn't...
Thanks

- Yowbarb
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Icon on April 18, 2010, 05:28:54 PM
I have went two days without food or drink,,, not drinking did not seem to bother me very much.
But did have a very dry mouth.
I did have a straw that allowed you to suck water from whatever source was at hand. Not sure of the name of it. Bought it like 15 years ago, and added it to my preps and forgot about it.
Will have to dig it out at some point and see if it is still good. Some filters have a shelf life.
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Carlg on April 20, 2010, 02:08:26 PM
http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/links/link.jsp;jsessionid=BWUY2UAKKMJCBLAQBBJSCOVMCAEFIIWE?id=0013055515228a&type=product&cmCat=froogle&cm_ven=data_feed&cm_cat=froogle&cm_pla=1510102&cm_ite=0013055515228a&_requestid=76648 (http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/links/link.jsp;jsessionid=BWUY2UAKKMJCBLAQBBJSCOVMCAEFIIWE?id=0013055515228a&type=product&cmCat=froogle&cm_ven=data_feed&cm_cat=froogle&cm_pla=1510102&cm_ite=0013055515228a&_requestid=76648)

This is just one type of WATER STRAW  if you want more just google "water straw" there are about 6 different kinds.
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Carlg on April 21, 2010, 10:07:22 AM
Some places to check out for testing

http://filter.filtersfast.com/search?w=water+testing (http://filter.filtersfast.com/search?w=water+testing)

http://www.air-n-water.com/water-testing-kit.htm (http://www.air-n-water.com/water-testing-kit.htm)

No matter what you will want some way to purify your drinking water and this is the one of the better systems. 
http://www.lifesaversystems.com/buy.html (http://www.lifesaversystems.com/buy.html)
Watch this video and you will be buying the bottle.
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Yowbarb on April 21, 2010, 12:34:16 PM
ICON and also Carl, very useful info on the drinking water purifier straw.
Going to get some of those.
All The Best,

Yowbarb
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Ed Douglas on May 02, 2010, 07:37:17 AM
This is a small picture of what can/will happen and there wasn't even a quake;  http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36891181/ns/local_news-cleveland_oh/ (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36891181/ns/local_news-cleveland_oh/)
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Yowbarb on May 02, 2010, 09:25:47 AM
Now that is really something to think about.
People need to prepare and prepare now.
Numero Uno is a stash of water. One thing that is good is a kit you can open up and pop into your tub. It provides a sanitary casing on the tub then you fill it with tap water while you still have it. Holds many gallons. The kit has a cover for the water, and a spigot, I think. Not pushing any particular product just to give an idea
for those who may not have heard of these:
http://www.aquapodkit.com/ (http://www.aquapodkit.com/)

(http://a1.vox.com/6a00d09e7bc293be2b00e398a62b290005-500pi)
...
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Carlg on September 28, 2010, 10:19:37 AM
Sorry for my absence.

It seems the water issue is fairly well covered with the different links.

The main issue is being prepared and knowing what to do.

I am not sure how much more one can be.   You need to have water stored all the time now matter what and then you need to be able to make any water drinkable in the future.

If things happer like they are saying it might then maybe I will end up saving urine and filtering that to survive.
I have a filter thats claims I can do this but things have not gotten bad enought for me to try it. :D
Just a thought.
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: noproblemo2 on September 28, 2010, 10:33:56 AM
Now that is really something to think about.
People need to prepare and prepare now.
Numero Uno is a stash of water. One thing that is good is a kit you can open up and pop into your tub. It provides a sanitary casing on the tub then you fill it with tap water while you still have it. Holds many gallons. The kit has a cover for the water, and a spigot, I think. Not pushing any particular product just to give an idea
for those who may not have heard of these:
http://www.aquapodkit.com/ (http://www.aquapodkit.com/)

(http://a1.vox.com/6a00d09e7bc293be2b00e398a62b290005-500pi)
...
This is a GREAT idea and holds 65 gallons of reserve water for emergencies !!!
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: mdahlen on October 23, 2010, 06:29:55 PM
I didn't see this in any forum search, wondering if you have seen this:

http://www.ecoloblue.com/ (http://www.ecoloblue.com/)

This would work for water anywhere without a natural source. You need power, but can run on solar, which they sell.
It isn't cheap, but if you want to have a valuable resource to barter with fresh water would be tops.

I figure if you have the solar setup, and the SHTF with regards to weather, perhaps you can pull then panel in high winds to prevent damage and then replace one things have settled, and be up and running with water.

maybe this needs to go to a devices type page, but seemed relevant here too.

Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: noproblemo2 on October 23, 2010, 06:37:16 PM
I didn't see this in any forum search, wondering if you have seen this:
http://www.ecoloblue.com/ (http://www.ecoloblue.com/)
This would work for water anywhere without a natural source. You need power, but can run on solar, which they sell.
It isn't cheap, but if you want to have a valuable resource to barter with fresh water would be tops.
I figure if you have the solar setup, and the SHTF with regards to weather, perhaps you can pull then panel in high winds to prevent damage and then replace one things have settled, and be up and running with water.
maybe this needs to go to a devices type page, but seemed relevant here too.
Welcome mdahlen. The solar set up is nice as is the regular tho as you say a tad pricey.
ECOLOBLUE 30 SOLAR PANEL BUNDLE

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An OFF-GRID Solution for the EcoloBlue 30 Atmospheric Water Generator.
The EcoloBlue 30 only requires 300 Watts to operate efficiently. The EB30 is specially equipped to efficiently operate at a lower consumption rate when attached to Solar Power.

This EB30 Solar Panel Kit will allow the EB30 to generate between 1-3 Gallons Water / day depending on the humidity conditions and sun conditions. This solution is intended for Emergency use or Off-Grid use.

This kit is modular and can be expanded depending on individual needs by adding extra solar panels and extra batteries to allow for longer runtime.
 
1 X EcoloBlue 30 Atmospheric Water Generator
CUSTOM CONFIGURATION AVAILABLE
1 x 300 WATT SOLAR PANEL  (1x27KG)
CONTROLLER 40A / 24 V + Accessories x 3 (cabling/hardware)
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While the standard is somewhat more reasonable ,Price: $1,699.00
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Jimfarmer on October 23, 2010, 07:37:49 PM
Another possibility:  Air Wells, or Dew Condensers.
For example:  http://www.opur.fr/ (http://www.opur.fr/)  and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_well_(condenser) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_well_(condenser)) .  Or google "air well" for more sources of info and designs.


Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: noproblemo2 on October 23, 2010, 07:42:34 PM
Another possibility:  Air Wells, or Dew Condensers.
For example:  http://www.opur.fr/ (http://www.opur.fr/)  and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_well_(condenser) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_well_(condenser)) .  Or google "air well" for more sources of info and designs.
These are great ideas for a moist environment such as mine. Thanks, will be doing much research on these.
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: augonit on December 28, 2010, 07:14:30 PM
I read some post under a different topic about dowsing (sp?) rods.  Where do you get these?  They're supposed to help you find water.
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Ed Douglas on December 29, 2010, 10:19:01 AM
Augie, you can make your own, even using clothes hangers. Basically they need to be 2 L shaped rods, so you can hold the at a 90 degree angle from the rods swinging in front of you. As you walk, or near water, the rods should react, by crossing, or going wild. Google it and find more specific info. The info I gave you was from watching my dad, and a 'dowser' friend of his, looking for a water source on our property when I was early teens. Didn't pay much attention, but know the rods crossed when he had a reation.   ed
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Jimfarmer on December 29, 2010, 10:42:11 AM
Hi augonit,
For more info about dowsing, see http://planetxtownhall.com/index.php/board,85.0.html (http://planetxtownhall.com/index.php/board,85.0.html).

For the home-made rods, you need to put the handle end in a small-bore tube so that they can rotate easily rather than pull against your grip.  Also, you must be thinking "there is water below me now" as you walk along, because your subconscious mind knows whether that statement is true or false, and will indicate "true" by tilting your hands a bit in order to make the rods swing out.  Study the technique first, and then it should work for you after a bit of practice.
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Ed Douglas on December 29, 2010, 11:01:28 AM
Good info, Jim. When I watched my dad and that gentleman do it years ago, they just held the rods in their hand. The tube idea is good. I forgot about the thinking part.lol I believe that dowsing with a "plumb bob" has the same type of result, except the plumb bob will start rotating or whatever it does for it's indication. It's a strange methodology, but seems effective.  ed
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Initalone on December 29, 2010, 03:34:31 PM
   Dowsing does work.  I have seen it used to locate underground pipes.  The person I saw doing this accurately locate steel process pipes 6" diamter, approximately 5 feet deep. The pipes carried a petroleum product.  The individual said he has located even small gauge wire by this method. He also stated that this method can be used to locate just about anything un-natural to the surrounding soil. 

The science behind dowsing is a mystery to me since the rods are not moved by magnetism, being made of aluminum, or even wood.

 The dowser used two aluminum rods about 1/4" diameter, and close to 2' in length. They were not anything special as he made them onsite. He would walk slowly holding his arms bent at the elbows, and steady.  The rods would cross, and he would mark the location.  He would then walk the opposite direction past his mark until they crossed again.  He measured the distance between the marks to find the center, which was directly over the pipe.  I was amazed at the accuracy.
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: augonit on December 30, 2010, 08:49:32 AM
This is very good information.  I'm going to try it to see if there is water on my property in case I have to dig a well.  Thanks.
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Hammerhead on June 09, 2011, 06:54:03 PM
I have 2 tubs in the house, I'm in....going to get a few of these.
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Yowbarb on June 17, 2011, 02:26:13 PM
Hi guys, I put this in a coupleof other posts, but no matter what equipment you go with (ANY gear for that matter) needs to be tested out by the end users. When TSHTF, you
May be using all your stuff in complete darkness. When the electricity goes, it gets very dark out with no ambient light. Make sure you can: find it in the dark, use it in the dark, clean & put it up in the dark!!!!    If it is important, dummy cord it to yourself or your pack so you don't LOSE it in the dark!

I know I sound bossy, but I get that way when talking about life saving procedures. It's IMPORTANT!

Go team!  ;D
Erv


Errrv thanks for all your ideas,
Yowbarb
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Kirt on December 18, 2011, 07:47:14 PM
How to Get Emergency Drinking Water from a Water Heater 

A typical home water heater can provide between 30 and 60 or more gallons of clean drinking water during a disaster. Hurricanes, floods, earthquakes, and other power outages may prevent you from having many things, but clean drinking water is not one of them.

I printed these steps off so that when the emergency comes I have the steps readily available

 http://www.wikihow.com/Get-Emergency-Drinking-Water-from-a-Water-Heater
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Yowbarb on October 12, 2012, 11:26:24 AM
Water Purification Techniques  11:34     131,627 Views

VIDEO Link:  http://youtu.be/ELBKBY-XY6w

Uploaded by wildernessoutfitters on Jul 5, 2009
http://www.thepathfinderschoolllc.com

 
Title: Re: Finding water in the wilderness
Post by: Yowbarb on October 13, 2012, 11:51:55 AM
http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Outdoor_Survival/Water   
Wiki Book
Outdoor Survival/Water

Contents 
1 Finding Water
2 Making Water Safer
3 If a natural water source is available
4 If a natural water source is not available
4.1 The evaporation still
4.2 The vegetation still
5 See also  Outdoor Survival/Water in the desert:  http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Outdoor_Survival/Water_in_the_desert

Humans can survive 3 days on average without water—less when it is very hot or one is very active (as opposed to weeks without food). A single day without water significantly reduces bodily and mental performance.
Water is an essential item on any camping or hiking trip. Some campgrounds have tap water, drawn from wells and purified. This water is of reliable quality under normal circumstances and should be used whenever practical. When tap water is not available, it is usually best to bring all necessary water from home. However, it is impossible to bring more than a couple of days' worth of water on a backpacking trip, and survival situations may create an unforeseen demand for water. If this demand is not met, dehydration will result, leading to heat exhaustion, heatstroke and death within days.
Please avoid the thought of rationing water. The best storage container in a survival situation is your own body. Even experienced soldiers have been found dead of dehydration with a full canteen.


Finding Water

You should have a map that shows water sources in the area where you plan to operate.
Water is most likely found where it is carried by natural terrain features such as ravines, gullies and washes.
Game trails leading down-slope may lead to water, but it may be miles away.
Water is more likely found in green areas with a good amount of vegetation.
Collect falling rainwater with a tarp, tent, or even clothing. It is safe. Funnel or wring it into containers (bottles, canteen, pots, you).
Quickly running water is more likely to be safe than large slow moving rivers or water in ponds and lakes.
Dew can be a water source when it condenses on any surface. Sop it up with a sponge or cloth.
You can get water by distillation from common leaves, grasses, and other green plants. Place an armload in a plastic bag/container, then leave it out in an area where it will get a lot of warmth and sunlight. Make sure that you don't use any poisonous plants, and that the container is sealed, so no water vapor escapes. Several such containers will be needed for a single person.
DO NOT drink seawater unless it is distilled! It takes twice as much water for your body to process seawater as you get from it.
NEVER drink urine, even if it is filtered.
Avoid eating snow in cold weather; doing so can significantly lower body temperature (as can becoming dehydrated) and even lead to shock.
Try to avoid stagnant water. It is more difficult to make safe.
Try to avoid brackish water. Purification or disinfection will not remove salt from brackish water.
Of the methods discussed above, only distillation and charcoal reduce risks from chemicals dissolved in water. Try to be aware of the risk of chemically-contaminated water in your area of operation.


Making Water Safer

You should always presume that water found in the outdoors contains disease-causing organisms. They are present far from any signs of human habitation. These organisms may have no effect on you if you drink the water without treatment OR they make cause debilitating illness or even death (See, for example, giardia, cryptosporidium, cholera, typhoid.). Therefore, you should do what you can to make the water safer.
Boiling is the most reliable method to kill all organisms in water. Bring the water to a rolling boil. Boil several minutes if at high altitude since water boils at a lower temperature at altitude. Even bringing water to temperature uncomfortably hot to the touch kills most organisms, but boil if you can.
Commercial filters in working condition and used correctly remove all organisms except viruses.
Chlorine dioxide (NOT "bleach" which is chlorine hydroxide) used according to directions will kill all organisms in water. Wait times may be four hours.
Water in a closed, clear container (Think 2 ltr. softdrink bottle.) if exposed to a day of strong sunlight is usually safe (See SODIS).
Water obtained by distillation (See above.) is usually safe.
A well dug ten feet/3 meters or more from a body of water and dug to a depth below the water level in that body of water, will gradually fill with water that is safer than the source body of water.
A filter of layers of grass, sand, and charcoal (from a fire site) inside a cone or cylinder of bark, plastic, aluminum foil or the like, will make water safer.
A filter of 6-8 layers of tightly-woven cloth will make water safer.
Allowing particles in water to settle to the bottom of a container and then treating the clearer water towards the top improves the resutls of treatment. Such "settling" of water, alone, makes water safer.
Any method that makes water safer, such as use of "bleach" (Chlorine hydroxide) or iodine, is better than not treating the water at all. Putting it another way, killing or otherwise eliminating some of the wee nasties is better than leaving them all for your body to fight.

AND
Bring "enough" safe water with you where ever you go OR have a method to render safe water from known sources. Be prepared.
If you have no water, avoid eating fats and proteins because your body uses water to process them. Juicy vegetable foods may be sources of water.
Always try to keep the sun off of you, regardless of how much clothing or sunblock you are wearing. It heats your body up over time, so you lose a LOT more water from your body from the extra sweating.
When melting snow in the winter, first melt a small amount in the bottom of a pot and then add more snow slowly. If you fill a pot with snow and put it over a fire, the snow at the bottom may sublimate directly into a gas, leaving the bottom of the pot dry and vulnerable to melting.
Pouring boiled water back and forth between pots after boiling will remove the flat taste. If you are very thirsty, you will not notice a flat taste.
If in the desert, do not remove your clothing as your sweat will evaporate more quickly and you will dehydrate faster. Ideally you want light colored, lightweight, loose clothing that covers as much skin as possible.
Do your work in the early mornings and at dusk to avoid the hottest part of the day. Get extra sleep during that time.
Your stomach is the best water container. People have been found dead of dehydration with water still in their canteens. Don't drink more than you need to, but don't be stingy with it either.
Always try to protect yourself as much as possible from the wind, it can dehydrate you in mere hours of exposure in areas with little cover, particularly mountains and plains.


If a natural water source is available

It is not difficult to obtain water from a natural body of fresh water such as a river or lake, but this water should not be used untreated. Natural water often contains organisms that cause infectious disease, most notably Giardia lamblia. There are four ways to remove this threat and make natural water potable.
Water may be boiled over a campfire or portable stove. At high altitudes, water boils at a lower temperature, so the boil must be maintained for several minutes to kill the microorganisms.
Water may be filtered with a portable water purification device. Water purifiers differ widely, so if you own one, familiarize yourself with the instruction manual. If the water is visibly dirty, pour it through a clean cloth to remove large particles and avoid prematurely clogging the purifier.
Certain chemicals, such as dilute chlorine solution, are commercially sold as antimicrobial additives. Some leave an unpleasant flavor that may be masked with powdered drink mix.
Water may be added to an evaporation still or solar still to purify the water through the natural evaporative process. Questionable water is added then when it evaporates it rises and condenses on a cooler surface. It then drips into your collection container where it can be collected using tubing to maintain the efficiency of your still. The warmer the still becomes the faster you will be able to collect pure water. Only a few chemicals will evaporate with the water one of which is benzene. This is usually only a concern when trying to purify flood waters.
This method can also be used to purify salt water. As long as the salt water is not allowed to get on your collection surface or in your collection container the water will be potable.


If a natural water source is not available

Water may also be obtained from the soil or from plant matter.
Probably the best way to get water from the ground is the evaporation still, shown in cross-section in the diagram at right. To build an evaporation still, you need only four items: a shovel, a sturdy sheet of transparent plastic, a cup, and a piece of flexible plastic tubing long enough to reach from the middle of the plastic sheet to the side with some excess length.
Begin by digging a hole with sloping sides in the shape of the sheet of plastic, but slightly smaller. Avoid digging in hot weather, as you will lose considerable amounts of water through sweat. Sink the cup in the middle of the hole so that the rim is almost flush with the sides of the hole. Place one end of the tube in the cup, run the other end to the outside of the hole, and place the sheet of plastic over the whole assembly. Weigh down the sides of the plastic sheet, or anchor them with stakes, and place a small weight directly over the cup.
The evaporation still will produce water continuously. The plastic sheet will create a greenhouse effect in the still, accelerating the natural evaporation of water from the soil. When the water vapor hits the plastic sheet, it will condense and drip down into the cup. The tubing may be used to drink from the cup without disturbing the still. For added effectiveness, use a second cup to pour any available water-based fluids, such as water collected from roofing or tent surfaces into the pit. A second tube would also work for this same purpose.


The vegetation still
An easier method uses just a plastic bag. Gather enough succulent vegetation (big leaves, cacti stripped of their thorns, etc.) to mostly fill the bag. Mash it to break through the leaves' outer water-resistant cuticle. As in the evaporation still, a greenhouse effect will cause water to evaporate from the leaves. It will then condense on the plastic and run down into the bottom of the bag.
The water in the bag will pick up chemicals from the leaves. These will give it a strong leafy flavor, and may include toxins, so make sure not to gather any poisonous plants.
Vegetation may also be added to an evaporative still to avoid the unpleasant taste but the used vegetation will have to be cleared out after the water has been collected from it. Preferably at night when the still is less effective.
See also

Outdoor Survival/Water in the desert  http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Outdoor_Survival/Water_in_the_desert

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