Yowbarb - SURVIVING the CHANGES > Surviving in Place

Some ideas to share - a start

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Hello Jay I hesitated to post here in your Topic Encampment until things were started. I do not consider myself an expert in survival skills or encampments, although I post up information as I find it and also share my ideas.
I was just in another Topic and I thought of this one. A lot of what I posted could be here.
It was partly about supplies and also some of my ideas on the initial actions in setting something up on the survival land. One thought I had was, early on, when the land is purchased and the person is making trips out there, solo or with 1 or 2 people -  to keep a low profile. Even if it is isolated there could be a highway nearby in fact that is likely. I had the idea to have a dozer out there first to dig down two three spots, in an area set back from the hwy. One would be like a little short road down and up. A dip set down far enough for a vehicle to drive down and stop in the middle.  The idea is to be less visible, in silhouette, and provide some modicum of security in trips out there.
Two things I didn't mention in the other post:
1) There needs to at least be some gravel. Or it would be a mud pit. Idea is to pave the little section of road if possible.
2) Have a flat spot in the middle, big enough for a camper and to easily get in and out of the thing.

So that is one doze job. Also there needs to be a couple dugouts for supplies, to set a shed down into or a cement container with an entrance at top or whatever will work, but it needs to be lockable and preferably hidden.
That way every time a person drives all the way out there he can at least take some supplies there and leave them.
Back soon.  - Yowbarb
The other discussion on storing stuff is here:

Ronnie James Survival Tools to Better Your Odds
Survival survey: where do you store your stuff?  http://planetxtownhall.com/index.php/topic,643.0.html

Just some of my thoughts and ideas I posted in another topic, on storage: Sorry some of this is a repeat read on further... YB

I suppose I would want to have a separate, buried storage room or bin made of steel - reinforced cement.
I would want it connected to or perhaps underneath the buried dome. Easy access to food water and supplies.  Note: When I get the survival spot the first thing I will do is have someone doze out a couple spots, set off away from the highway.  Set down an impromptu shelter and also
a place to drive a vehicle down into-  to hide. A ramp down. Goes up at the other end. Far enough down of a little dip that the vehicle could not be easily seen "in silhouette," if it's flat, open country.  Added Note: Gravel or pave the little dip hideout road. Otherwise it will be a mud pit which is hard to get out of.
I figure I will end up with open flat land or perhaos some badlands with rocks in a plateu area. Hardly a tree. No river to overflow and flood.
The ideas is: Less stuff to fuel a major fire. (NOTE: There will be forest fires and grass fires in many places on the earth, if the PX scenario
happens in a certain way, with meteorites, big lightning strikes, etc.)

Also I would want a buried shelter for supplies. Keeping a low profile as much as possible. I figure most people will have to make several trips out to a location perhaps alone or with one person. Important to put a stash of things there and at least some shelter in case the earth changes
happen in an inconvenient time frame - before everything is done. Something done is better than nothing done.

Once things are getting organized:
In a separate buried area, I would have one for gasoline for vehicles, etc.. This could maybe be one of those smallish steel rooms from containers.
I recommend putting a few wooden or hard plastic pole braces to reinforce the corners and wall of the steel containers. Even steel containers could possibly bend and crumple in places due to earth movements. All we can predict is all hades will probably break loose for awhile so may as well brace and reinforce everything as much as possible.

I would have one of these too, separate location for propane, etc. 
Not having the exact technology of handling things so they do not explode - especially during earth movements - I would want to put these
fuel areas set away from the main shelter for people.  Anything, any item I felt would be a hazard I would separate out from the living quarters.

Another idea I had which was posted before in a few places: 
A padded storage area needs to be created. Glass or plastic storage jars - anything breakable could weather the changes  (I feel)
if they were set down in a cement box - with styrofoam and newspapers etc.
There should be a grid pattern made of wood.
Some space and some "give" in the amount of space for items in case of earth movements. 
Lining the compartments would be paper, plastic bags, styrofoam to "pad" the things you are storing.
This should be set down in the floor of the dome
Food and water and supplies need to be accessed by the group without going to a separate location for things.
Whatever cooking setup there is inside the shelter needs to be as non - hazardous as possible.

NOTE:  I have posted before, and recomended that each member of the group start out with a knapsack of drinks and snacks to start out with in case the earth movements, weather and so on going on outside and all the changes makes it a little hard to function in the beginning.
Everyone should sit down or lay down and just have an easy to drink beverage with a lid and straw, during the worst of the events.  Assuming the structure holds up [other Topics on this] there still could be earth movement and things falling down etc.
I feel whoever is setting it up and in charge needs to have things ready and this includes prepared baby bottles you just open up. It has to be ready, ready and at hand for that time when the outside doors and hatches get closed and the outside conditions are impossible to survive. (Will such a day come? I cannot say for sure, I believe that day will come.)

There has been a lot of discussion about how glass jars would break but glass is still the best container for canned goods.  Fresh garden - produced canned goods will really add to the nutrition, and these are put into glass jars. If a person or group just cannot take the time to can anything for the survival cache, it is possible to buy these things from Mennonites, Amish and Hutterites groups like these. If there are any of them near you. [May post a separate Topic on where the communities are so goods can be purchased from them. This will be in a Topic like where to find foods etc.]
Food can be put into sterilized glass and properly sealed. (Regular canning procedure.) It is non toxic, washable, sterilizable and reusable. 
Also some foods come mainly in glass jars.  I know many people wouldn't want to deal with the possibility of breaking glass but if it is set up right, as mentioned above -  it could be OK.

Regarding the water bottles the idea is to have lots and lots of water and there might not be time to be too "fancy schmancy" about the containers so if plastic is all
there is, then the storage containers need to protect that plastic.

I know there are probably better solutions but plastic is easy to grab and haul and throw in the storage area.
Sometimes the quickest way will work precautions need to be taken to protect the goods though.

Within the encampment: The shelter itself should be reinforced and I feel the geodesic dome is strongest. Dome at least partially buried.

Of course if someone can afford a pre-made installed underground shelter that would be good also.
Old Missile bases would be good as long as they were free of radiation or other contamination. Government sold off a lot of these and the owners renovate some. Some get sold as-is.

Well, for the purposes of this topic, Encampment, home, is whatever can be dug out and constructed with whatever materials are at hand and whatever can be afford or done.
In the future there may be more than one camp and it could partly have to do with conditions in the Aftertimes, weather, etc.

Hopefully, wherever a person or group "digs in," for survival is the place they can stay and live.

Also I would recommend having a pit - stash of recycled material. I would set this far away from the group's shelter home. My concept is whenever a person goes out to their camp in the early stages, they can haul not only supplies - they can haul recyclable materials of all kinds. Other Topic, materials for construction in the Aftertimes, such as rubber tires, scrap cardboard and paper, string, wire, chicken wire, loose boards and scrap woods, tin cans, and soda cans. With a little duct tape, glue, wire, wet newspaper and cement, many a building can be constructed in the Aftertime - if the group has a stash of materials.

If there is enough of it, buried out on the property it can be used and also possibly bartered
in the Aftertime. If there are fires in the aftertime, things like materials of any kind and/or scrap wood for cooking fires - these will be at a premium. Half of what is being thrown away could be used someday to build more houses.
I have chinked log cabins with wet newspapers so I know how simple materials like these can provide warmth and shelter.
I had some ideas on how to dump the stuff in a pit so it could be retrieved. May as well add it here. If there is a deep pit or trench on the land there could be a bit of cement or pallets down on the bottom to help with moisture. Some sort of metal mesh net could be put in there, attacked at the end to a rope. The rope would be staked at the tip. Then on top of that is a heavy lid or even a wooden lid  is better than nothing. Things get thrown down in there. Any kind of clean material - NO food - just boards, scrap wood, metal, chicken wire, boards, cardboard, tires, etc.
The idea is. A person can use the rope, which is staked at the top if the pit, to pull up the mesh and retrieve materials. It may not be so easy to do but several people could help pull it up . Whatever works for the group.
One suggestion: A separate pit also with the mesh net and some kind of padding thrown in glass bottles could be gently lowered down in bags. The idea is to NOT break them and get a good large stash of them. The glass bottles of different colors are beautiful used as building materials. All it takes is some cement and some bottles and a person can make a beautiful little house. If the group has some dome building kits stashed away in storage, many domes could be put up on the property and the cement and glass could be used to reinforce the outsides. The glass bottles could make a solid secure deep set-in window. Can't really see in but multicolored light would come in.


Ideas, anyone?

- Yowbarb[/color]


Regarding Hiding supplies:
A hunter who had a cabin in the middle of 6 hundred acres hid his supplies from "freeloaders, etc." by burying an old chest freezer in the ground up to the lid and covering the top with old scrap sheet metel and boards to make it look like a trash pile.  Of course, he also put a lock on the lid.

This makes a Faraday cage and will keep out wildlife, water, freeloaders, etc.

Great idea Terigaddy, and welcome to the board if I haven't done that already.



--- Quote from: Terigaddy on July 23, 2010, 10:14:38 AM ---Regarding Hiding supplies:
A hunter who had a cabin in the middle of 6 hundred acres hid his supplies from "freeloaders, etc." by burying an old chest freezer in the ground up to the lid and covering the top with old scrap sheet metel and boards to make it look like a trash pile.  Of course, he also put a lock on the lid.

This makes a Faraday cage and will keep out wildlife, water, freeloaders, etc.

--- End quote ---

Terigaddy this sounds like a good idea to me. For starters, until a group can get more fancy - a whole bunch of old freezers could be set down
to create caches of stuff. This could be while the organizing, trips to the site and building is going on... If people aren't able to put buried steel containers they surely should be able to do some old freezers.
Todays scrap metal or junk is tomorrow's gold for survival uses. Thanks for posting,


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