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Author Topic: Complicated / detailed PERMACULTURE  (Read 12986 times)

Socrates

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to chop and drop
« Reply #30 on: June 12, 2017, 04:48:15 AM »
Whenever rainfall exceeds evaporation, conditions are ideal for chop and drop mulching. During the portion of the year where you see the most rainfall, that’s when you should start creating mulch. Not only will the added moisture help with the decomposition process, it will also keep the mulch in place.
To chop and drop is about letting non-fruit-bearing flora like comfrey or kuzu [good examples of chop-and-drop plants] grow, only for you to cut them down and let them rot/decompose. Such plants not only fix nitrogen in the soil as they grow but also add minerals to soil, and create soil, as they decompose.

It is a very basic principle, however, it is a principle that's completely alien to conventional systems that hoe, weed and burn away organic matter rather than utilize them.

Chop and drop, however, is a tactic that's really more appropriate for moderate climates, for if it's too hot or dry, no rot/decomposition will take place. The hotter and dryer it is, the more one may be interested in using things like kuzu or comfrey cuttings in shaded places or in compost heaps.
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R.R. Book

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Re: Complicated / detailed PERMACULTURE
« Reply #31 on: June 12, 2017, 04:56:21 AM »
That might be a good way to reclaim the soil in our henyard Socrates, a very difficult task indeed.  If nothing else, it would attract bugs and other small critters for the hens to prey upon.   Thanks for suggesting it!

Socrates

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starting without soil
« Reply #32 on: August 06, 2017, 10:47:47 PM »
So let's say you have a piece of dirt and it looks like this...

What do you do?

Conventional thinking would have you bulldozing it, using one of these

and mixing your newly-turned dirt with some manure and/or fertilizer.
[One can go in all directions / variables with this principle, like using seawater instead of fertilizer or a pickaxe instead of machinery, but in the end the result is the same.]

As a lone and poorly-funded individual, i might have watered such land until it becomes able to get yer trowel or shovel in there. Unfortunately, this takes exorbitant amounts of water. As well, it essentially drowns whatever microorganisms you (still) have living in said soil. Or i might've waited [and waited and waited] until [finally] rain comes and i can get in there with  my trowel or shovel or pickaxe.
Either way, a terrible waste of water...

A smart thing to do would be to cover whatever plot you have in mind to garden with dead organic material; this can be hay / dead grass, wood chips [ideally] or other materials [thinking pieces of rotted log, 'straw', etc.] Then, when it rains (or when you throw some water [or pee] on it), said moisture will immediately become part of a microcosm of organics rather than evaporate, drown subterranean lifeforms or be otherwise wasteful.
Soil is about planning; it's about knowledge and patience and about doing away with the bad without destroying the good; that's why they call it "soil management".
[It could be your plot is at altitude and you have to carry all of your water uphill; but even 1 liter per day can make a big difference if it's absorbed by a microcosm of subterranean flora and fauna that base their existence on not allowing water to escape...]

After a while, a few weeks or a year [depending on the circumstances, your efforts and your needs] that hard-packed soil you started out with will have become accessible to digging and planting. Once the soil is moist and one-celled organisms start multiplying [exponentially], said life will be able to take advantage of things like moisture, added minerals [wood chips, seawater solution, etc.] and whatever seeds you add to the mix.

On the other hand, if you're an ignorant basterd who's been conditioned to assume that 'modern agriculture' is a feasible model / paradigm, all you'll be doing is whining and wailing how you have no good soil to work with, not enough water, your animals have nothing to sustain them and how you're suffering from 'bad luck'...3179
« Last Edit: August 07, 2017, 03:07:26 AM by Socrates »
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Socrates

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great soil for your plants
« Reply #33 on: January 13, 2020, 09:31:58 AM »
a colleague asked me about guano and i replied: Why not just use seawater?
Then i started, kinda ranting, on other things one can do, like biochar, magnetite, etc.
Anyway, this post is for him [that i might simply send him a short url] and therefore in Dutch.


- goede aarde: in een bos heb je bepaalde plekken waar water nooit verdampt en de aarde zich alsmaar ontwikkelt. Dit in tegenstelling tot de meeste aarde in een bos dat vaak maar een paar cm diep is. Zoek een mooie plek op, waarschijnlijk een verdieping waar de zon nooit direkt op schijnt, en haal daar aarde vandaan. Als je de bladeren en takjes/takken verwijdert, zul je daar dan tot wel een meter diep [of meer] zeer vruchtbare aarde vinden. Prima om je zaden in te laten ontkiemen.

- Magnetiet is een soort ijzer dat magnetische krachten geeft aan je planten die ze goed kunnen gebruiken. Tot 10% van je grond kan uit magnetiet bestaan, maar als je maar 1 tot 5% magnetiet in je grond hebt, kun je al veel resultaat zien. [Volg link om te bestellen.]

- Ik vond een mooie video over geactiveerde kool maken voor je. Grappig genoeg praat die man in de vid over het gebruiken van vleermuispoep... Maar volgens mij kun je het ook prima zonder doen, zeker als je al zeewater gebruikt [waar hij het niet over heeft].


Je kunt eindeloos doorgaan en waarschijnlijk wil je experimenteren. Weet je dat je wilgentakken een dag in water kunt laten trekken en dat de groeihormonen van de wilg de water dan zozeer beïnvloeden dat je elke tak van elke boom snel kunt laten wortelen? Nou, stel dat je die groeihormonen op je plantjes loslaat...? Nooit geprobeerd, nooit iemand over gehoord, maar klinkt logisch.
Als je niet weet wat kompost is, hier heb je twee (engelstalige) links om je op weg te helpen. Ik heb zelf ook wat keukenafval in de tuin gedumpt en voor je het weet [een paar weken] is het tot aarde geworden. Geen hogere wiskunde. Gooi er wat zeezout bij en zorg dat 't nat blijft en je weet niet wat je ziet.
- Composting
- Mijn online forum hierover

Sukses, man!  ;D
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R.R. Book

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Re: Complicated / detailed PERMACULTURE
« Reply #34 on: January 13, 2020, 04:57:53 PM »
Maybe, Soc, you could begin an entire Dutch language thread, in addition to interpreting scattered articles?  What an asset to TH!

ilinda

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Re: Complicated / detailed PERMACULTURE
« Reply #35 on: January 14, 2020, 06:53:21 PM »
Needless to say, it was Greek to me....oops, Dutch.  LOL   

Showed it to hubby who knows a smattering of German and he said it looks like a hodgepodge of several languages, German, French, and ???   LOL 

Thanks for posting whateve you posted, Soc.  LOL

Socrates

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Re: Dutch
« Reply #36 on: January 15, 2020, 11:51:00 PM »
Maybe, Soc, you could begin an entire Dutch language thread, in addition to interpreting scattered articles?
I've always felt the Dutch should just be able to read English comfortably [i.e. not get a headache by doing so]. It's also why i raised my son in English and why i spoke mostly English with my former gf [who needed the practice]. English is actually the language used at university, which is really weird as a lot of teachers aren't very well-versed in speaking it and both natives and foreign students alike are often stuck with poor grammar, vocabulary and pronounciation practices.
I feel my son suffered from me not speaking Dutch with him but the choice had to be made and he already benefits in various ways, being able to take full advantage of things like YouTube and view movies many Dutch kids can't follow.
My sister married an English bloke and her kids speak perfect Dutch and English. That's the way to go.
IMHO if you're Dutch and you haven't/don't make a concerted effort to master the English language, you've made a conscious decision to cripple your access to cutting edge information and sources that fall outside popular/mainstream culture [i.e. popular enough to get translated into Dutch]. In the information age that's just stupid.
At least in this instance my colleague knows enough to approach me if he has this kind of query. But he's helped me out in the past too, so all's good.
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R.R. Book

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Re: Complicated / detailed PERMACULTURE
« Reply #37 on: January 16, 2020, 04:34:32 AM »
That makes sense Soc.  I wonder though, particularly at the university level, if something is lost in the translation between English and Dutch when professors are obligated to teach in their second language?  The reason I ask is that I occasionally attend an Amish worship service (in their homes), and they'll switch from PA Dutch (which is German) to English for my sake, except for certain Bible passages which they say are much richer and more meaningful in German.  My understanding is that there are some words and phrases that simply don't translate well into English.


Socrates

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Re: lost in translation
« Reply #38 on: January 16, 2020, 08:35:48 AM »
Of course things are lost in translation, which is why i'm actually opposed to this practice of teaching in English at university.
I came to this country in 1976 and i learned long ago that the Dutch think they know how to speak English when they actually don't do so very well. I mean, hell, after 3 months in Turkey i could carry on basic conversations in Turkish but that didn't mean i could "speak Turkish".
I always tell the Dutch: If you think you speak English, you are underestimating how well you speak Dutch...

Frankly, it's easy enough; send your kid off to some English-speaking country or other for (the total of) a year or so and then oblige them to read English once in a while. Force feeding them English through 'the system', especially as adults, is pointless.
P.S. Funny on topic vid: The Perks of Being Bilingual.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2020, 04:53:57 PM by Socrates »
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Re: Complicated / detailed PERMACULTURE
« Reply #39 on: January 16, 2020, 11:37:26 AM »
That link was hilarious!

I studied 4 years of German in highschool and one in college, culminating in a requirement to translate Also Sprach Zarathustra, and still can only understand about every other word the local German-speaking people are saying.  The worst part of that language for me is the articles - too many ways to say "the."  So I end up guessing on some of it.  Same with French.  It can be an interesting endeavor to journey into the psychology of why Europeans consider some material objects to be feminine, masculine or neuter...Someone must have spent a lot of time thinking that system up... :)

My sons' (New Orleans) French grandmother sent them bilingual story books when they were pre-schoolers, in which each page of the books had French on the left and English of the same part of the story on the right, with lots of pictures, so the children could pick it up as they went.  That may be a good age to teach children for whom being bilingual is not an immediate need (such as for children with a close family member who speaks another language primarily, and who may need to be bilingual from birth).


ilinda

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Re: Complicated / detailed PERMACULTURE
« Reply #40 on: January 17, 2020, 01:33:10 PM »
That's a LOT  of German you studied--five years.  But do you think the reason you only understand some of what the local German speakers are saying is that, over the years, they've developed their own dialect which is (quite) different from what you learned?

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Re: Complicated / detailed PERMACULTURE
« Reply #41 on: January 17, 2020, 05:11:59 PM »
That's true - I actually understand their High German hymnals better than I understand them - LOL!  :)

Socrates

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Re: 'school'...
« Reply #42 on: January 18, 2020, 01:23:52 AM »
I took 5 years of French, at the highest level of schooling for teens, and i speak sh!t French. I've met people who vacationed in France reqularly who speak way better French then i do and i've met people who've just spent a year in France who speak way better French than i do.
The mainstream school system sucks ass. It is a waste of time and resources.
If they'd just sent me to France for a few months i could've forgone 5 years of torture in class 2 or 3 hours a week with nothing to show for my efforts.

If you want results, then take appropriate action. If you're about politically correct initiatives that are all about cosmestics, then send a kid to school doing classes.
The ancient guild system at least got teens prepared to acquire some basic skills that would prepare them for a career; modern schooling is about baby sitting 'slaves-to-the-system-to-be'...

Learning a language is easy when you're young and if politicians were actually interested in having people learn languages they would take advantage of that simple principle.
Let me share one of my theories/principles: society is about a 3-column force of information, communication and organization and THEY don't want us to be well organized or able to communicate, i.e. translate.
The politically correct system invites things to be lost in translation. It's called politics...
Incompetence is the fertile ground upon which politics grows.

Just a few days ago i tried to explain to my 11 y.o. son that this period in his life is unique and powerful, that things that he learns during these years stay with him easily his entire life and that muscles built during these years will stay with him forever [since that's my experience].
As a child and teen you're so chock-full of growth hormones that progress if effortless. It's a damn shame to put that to waste, but mainstream culture has the school system basically baby-sitting children and teens, keeping their potential bottled up until it's gone forever...
There are many countries in the world where it's common for people to speak 4 languages fluently, but politicians act like such things are superhuman. There are windows of opportunity here.
None different for taking advantage of our window to prepare for TEOTWAWKI...
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Re: Complicated / detailed PERMACULTURE
« Reply #43 on: January 18, 2020, 05:26:45 AM »
Very well said!

ilinda

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Re: 'school'...
« Reply #44 on: January 18, 2020, 02:36:39 PM »
I took 5 years of French, at the highest level of schooling for teens, and i speak sh!t French. I've met people who vacationed in France reqularly who speak way better French then i do and i've met people who've just spent a year in France who speak way better French than i do.
The mainstream school system sucks ass. It is a waste of time and resources.
If they'd just sent me to France for a few months i could've forgone 5 years of torture in class 2 or 3 hours a week with nothing to show for my efforts.

If you want results, then take appropriate action. If you're about politically correct initiatives that are all about cosmestics, then send a kid to school doing classes.
The ancient guild system at least got teens prepared to acquire some basic skills that would prepare them for a career; modern schooling is about baby sitting 'slaves-to-the-system-to-be'...

Learning a language is easy when you're young and if politicians were actually interested in having people learn languages they would take advantage of that simple principle.
Let me share one of my theories/principles: society is about a 3-column force of information, communication and organization and THEY don't want us to be well organized or able to communicate, i.e. translate.
The politically correct system invites things to be lost in translation. It's called politics...
Incompetence is the fertile ground upon which politics grows.

Just a few days ago i tried to explain to my 11 y.o. son that this period in his life is unique and powerful, that things that he learns during these years stay with him easily his entire life and that muscles built during these years will stay with him forever [since that's my experience].
As a child and teen you're so chock-full of growth hormones that progress if effortless. It's a damn shame to put that to waste, but mainstream culture has the school system basically baby-sitting children and teens, keeping their potential bottled up until it's gone forever...
There are many countries in the world where it's common for people to speak 4 languages fluently, but politicians act like such things are superhuman. There are windows of opportunity here.
None different for taking advantage of our window to prepare for TEOTWAWKI...
You touch on things I've wanted to say for years!

For starters, the schools there must be a lot like most American public schools--everyone starts the first grade at the same age, even if the kid is ready two or three years earlier.  Nope.  We gotta have uniformity!

And dole out the info. piecemeal, make the kids work a tiny bit, but whatever you do in this public school--don't make them think too hard, or maybe not at all.

TPTB definitely don't want children to grow up questioning authority, and then questioning their answers.  No siree!  The last thing TPTB want is for some children to ask why Roundup is being sprayed along the roadsides, where milkweed grows--the only food for disappearing Monarch butterflies.

 And God forbid the children ask why the lead mines are still gouging giant caverns in the earth to dredge up a heavy metal which is neurotoxic, and for which there was NEVER any use above ground, until TPTB sat around in their think tanks and dreamed up uses--"Hey, let's put it in paint, and slather it all over the inner cities!"  And then, "Hey, let's put lead into the cheaper version of gasoline, so the poor people will inhale deeply while gassing up, and will of course suffer much more dire effects than those who drive more expensive cars, requiring non-leaded gasoline".  (That one worked for quite a while).

And let's not get school kids to ask why the EPA is ushering more and more toxins, in pesticides, asbestos, and a host of other products, and we especially don't want the children to ask, who appoints the head of the EPA?

Maybe the reason that so many of the winners of the National Spelling Bees in recent years have been home-schooled kids.  I could go on, but enough of the soapbox.

One tidbit that ties in with this theme and which shows how even some parents are totally brainwashed!  Friend of ours, Rick, told us when his daughter was about 5 and they lived in Key West, that a friend of hers was Hispanic, and daughter would visit them often.  One day daughter came home saying some Spanish words after the girls were sharing words with each other.  The words were common things such as casa for house, hombre for man, perro for dog, etc., etc.  Friend Rick said they abruptly stopped letting daughter play with her little friend because, "We didn't want her learnin' no Spanish!"

Interestingly, "they" say that if a person can speak one of three or four certain languages they can communicate with a great percentage of the world's population, but if they learn two or three of those certain languages, they can communicate with the great majority of them. 

IIRC, those languages are Mandarin, Spanish, English, and ???  Anyone know one or more of the others?

 

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